回到圣經找答案
本帖最后由 费事傾 于 2013-11-17 16:37 编辑回到聖經找答案紙紗窗叫人回到聖經找答案, 我就回到聖經找答案, 讓教徒以及非教徒看清楚, 耶和華有多麽慈愛。列王記下
2:23 以利沙從那裡上伯特利去．正上去的時候、有些童子從城裡出來、戲笑他、說、禿頭的上去罷、禿頭的上去罷。
2:24 他回頭看見、就奉耶和華的名咒詛他們。於是有兩個母熊從林中出來、撕裂他們中間四十二個童子。费事傾有聯讚曰:童子無知, 出言不遜。上帝逞暴, 下手兇殘。
橫批: 神愛世人 “He went up from there to Bethel, and while he was going up on the way, some small boys came out of the city and jeered at him, saying, ‘Go up, you baldhead! Go up, you baldhead!’ And he turned around, and when he saw them, he cursed them in the name of the LORD. And two she-bears came out of the woods and tore forty-two of the boys”
(2 Kings 2:23-24)
2 Kings 2:23-24 is a fascinating and in some ways worrisome passage, especially as it is represented in many translations of the Bible. There is a more reasonable explanation for the violent event than simply removing things from their context and imagining that Elisha simple used a couple bears to kill some children who were mocking him.
It’s important to note that at this point in history, the northern kingdom of Israel has taken upon itself the identity of Canaan.
Centuries earlier, Joshua had led the people of Israel out of the wilderness, over the Jordan, and into the land of Canaan at God’s mandate. Israel was simultaneously reaping the promise of blessing with which God had privileged them and acting as the arm of God’s divine judgment against a people who had set themselves up as the enemies of God. As God judges all men, so he here judged the civilizations residing in the land of Canaan (doing so in the earthly realm as a pedagogical tool for future generations) and Joshua acts as his divinely appointed hand. The inhabitants of Canaan perished because they had positioned themselves as the enemies of God.
A few hundred years after Joshua’s conquer of Canaan, the kingdom of Israel split into two separate nations, the Southern Kingdom of Judah (which comprised Jerusalem and the temple—where ordained worship of God occurred) and the Northern Kingdom of Israel. As the Northern Kingdom had no ordained center of worship, its newly founded king, Jeroboam, decided to create two—rather than risk Israelites heading into the Southern Kingdom in order to worship and falling under Judah’s power. To counter Judah’s prominence as the center of worship, Jeroboam set up altars in both Bethel and Dan.
And yet here he begins to reverse Joshua’s accomplishment by inviting the Northern Kingdom to taking on the identity of Canaanites rather than as the people of God. In Dan and in Bethel, Jeroboam crafts golden calves, intentionally reminiscent of that prepared by Aaron on Sinai, and invokes Sinai’s peculiar Aaronic benediction saying, “You have gone up to Jerusalem long enough. Behold your gods, O Israel, who brought you up out of the land of Egypt” (1 Kings 12:25ff). Jeroboam invites the Northern Kingdom to forego worship of God in Jerusalem and sets precedent for them to worship crafted gods, as the Canaanites had.
A couple more centuries pass and the Northern Kingdom has fully embraced its identity as being a nation who will have nothing to do with the God who had brought them to the land they inhabit. They have, for all intents, become the enemies of God every bit as much as the Canaanites had been before them. It is into this land and before this people that the story of Elisha insinuates itself.
Elisha, like Joshua before him, is operating as the hand of God on earth. He renders judgment and offers mercy as God does. And it is in this capacity as God’s servant that he comes to Bethel, one of the centers of pagan worship and headquarters of the enemies of God. And out of the city come the servants of the temple, the officials and leaders of idolatrous worship, to call down curses on Elisha and to threaten his life. These are the self-proclaimed enemies of God and they threaten the life of God’s own envoy and servant. It is little wonder they meet with a bad end.
But how are we to know that these are servants of the temple? Most translations describe them as children or young men.
The word Hebrew translated here as “children” (na’ar) often means official or servant and doesn’t necessarily even refer to age at all. Mephibosheth’s servant Ziba is referred to as na’ar (2 Samuel 16:1), yet he has fifteen sons. The man that Boaz has positioned as boss over his fieldworkers is na’ar—not a position one grants to children (Ruth 2:5-6). The word na’ar is translated as “servant” over fifty times (roughly a fifth of the times it appears in Scripture).
Not only were these men servants of pagan deities, they heard of Elisha’s approach and came to meet him with threats. It had been big and recent news that Elisha’s mentor Elijah had just vanished from the face of the earth. While Scripture records that he had been taken up to heaven alive and in a chariot of flame, many at the time believed that this was merely a cute story to cover up Elijah’s death. In saying “Go on up!” They are both mocking what they presume to have been the death of Elijah and a threatening similar fate (death) to Elisha.
These truly are the enemies of God and Elisha. They have willingly taken on the identity of those who Joshua, God’s divine hand, was commanded to conquer. They have chosen to be conquered by their choice to oppose the army of the Lord. And so, it seems less drastic then that Elisha should pass judgment on those who, as enemies of God, are threatening the life of the earthly hand of God. 恐怖份子的行為, 是可以從圣經找到答案的, 請看:
聖經宗教歧視--教你破壞別教物品
出埃及記
23:24 你不可跪拜他們的神、不可事奉他、也不可效法他們的行為、卻要把神像盡行拆毀、打碎他們的柱像。
申命記
7:5 你們卻要這樣待他們、拆毀他們的祭壇、打碎他們的柱像、砍下他們的木偶、用火焚燒他們雕刻的偶像。 恐怖份子的行為, 是可以從圣經找到答案的, 請看:
聖經宗教歧視--教你破壞別教物品
出埃及記
23:24 你不可跪拜他們的神、不可事奉他、也不可效法他們的行為、卻要把神像盡行拆毀、打碎他們的柱像。
申命記
7:5 你們卻要這樣待他們、拆毀他們的祭壇、打碎他們的柱像、砍下他們的木偶、用火焚燒他們雕刻的偶像。
费事傾 发表于 2013-10-22 16:01 http://bbs.51.ca/images/common/back.gif
哦，这么说现在的恐怖分子是上帝派下来的？ 回到聖經找答案紙紗窗叫人回到聖經找答案, 我就回到聖經找答案, 讓教徒以及非教徒看清楚, 耶和華有多麽慈愛。列王記下
2:23 以利沙從那裡上伯特利去．正上去的時候、有些童子從城裡出來、戲笑他、說、禿頭的上去罷、禿頭的上去罷。
2:24 他回頭看見、就奉耶和華的名咒詛他們。於是有兩個母熊從林中出來、撕裂他們中間四十二個童子。费事傾有聯讚曰:童子無知, 出言不遜。上帝逞暴, 下手兇殘。
橫批: 神愛世人
费事傾 发表于 2013-10-22 12:18 http://bbs.51.ca/images/common/back.gif
在另一个帖子里，51网资某深信徒给人划定了七项原罪，我也是依据圣经回复说，这七项原罪其实都是上帝给的。结果信徒们老大的意见。所以在圣经里找答案也是有选择性的。 本帖最后由 费事傾 于 2013-10-23 13:34 编辑
為什麼不見主內弟兄姊妹們為耶和辯護呢?
聖經是这样講的, 無從辯護。那就讓我來代勞吧。
这根本不關耶和華事, 他是無辜的。以利沙 “奉耶和華的名咒詛他們”, 又關耶和華什麼事?
如果有人拿槍瘋狂掃射, 說是奉紙紗窗的名殺人, 可以入紙紗窗罪嗎?
我可以这样為耶和華辯護, 教徒們不可以。因為这样就顯得耶和華無能, 可以任由別人盜用他的名字去做出殘忍的事。
我只用簡單几句話, 就己為耶和華洗脫罪名, 但教徒長篇大論, 卻不知所謂。
看那篇英文吧, 扯到王國分裂, 看得雲山雾罩。
其实看这兩句就够了:
The word Hebrew translated here as “children” (na’ar) often means official or servant and doesn’t necessarily even refer to age at all.
These truly are the enemies of God and Elisha.
原來不是童子, 是官員或僕人, 他們是上帝和以利沙的仇敵。
既然上帝愛世人, 又怎會有仇敵? 是仇敵又怎样, 耶穌不是口口聲聲說要愛仇敵, 為逼迫你的人禱告嗎? 嘲笑一聲 “禿頭” 就要叫兩個母熊從林中出來、撕裂他們中間四十二個嗎?
这根本就是寫圣經的人心充滿仇恨, 於是一個恨字貫串着整本圣經。
我实实在告訴你, 圣經是兒童不宜的。 圣經说好也好说不好也不好 时事新闻？ 到底发生了什么？ let me know pls
圣經鼓勵強姦
申命記22:28若有男子遇見沒有許配人的處女、抓住他與他行淫、被人看見、
22:29這男子就要拿五十舍客勒銀子、給女子的父親、因他玷污了這女子、就要娶他為妻、終身不可休他。 圣经是一个整体，我们不能把它割裂了，找到合乎自己心意的随意而用，不合自己心意的就弃之不理。“那字句是叫人死，精意是叫人活”，就是这意思了。 為什麼不見主內弟兄姊妹們為耶和辯護呢?
聖經是这样講的, 無從辯護。那就讓我來代勞吧。
这根本不關耶和華事, 他是無辜的。以利沙 “奉耶和華的名咒詛他們”, 又關耶和華什麼事?
如果有人拿槍瘋狂掃射, 說是奉紙紗窗的名殺人, 可以入紙紗窗罪嗎?
我可以这样為耶和華辯護, 教徒們不可以。因為这样就顯得耶和華無能, 可以任由別人盜用他的名字去做出殘忍的事。
我只用簡單几句話, 就己為耶和華洗脫罪名, 但教徒長篇大論, 卻不知所謂。
看那篇英文吧, 扯到王國分裂, 看得雲山雾罩。
其实看这兩句就够了:
The word Hebrew translated here as “children” (na’ar) often means official or servant and doesn’t necessarily even refer to age at all.
These truly are the enemies of God and Elisha.
原來不是童子, 是官員或僕人, 他們是上帝和以利沙的仇敵。
既然上帝愛世人, 又怎會有仇敵? 是仇敵又怎样, 耶穌不是口口聲聲說要愛仇敵, 為逼迫你的人禱告嗎? 嘲笑一聲 “禿頭” 就要叫兩個母熊從林中出來、撕裂他們中間四十二個嗎?
这根本就是寫圣經的人心充滿仇恨, 於是一個恨字貫串着整本圣經。
我实实在告訴你, 圣經是兒童不宜的。
费事傾 发表于 2013-10-23 13:32 http://bbs.51.ca/images/common/back.gif
哦，照你这样讲，圣经还不如西游记了。 哦，照你这样讲，圣经还不如西游记了。
xuxi 发表于 2013-10-23 19:31 http://bbs.51.ca/images/common/back.gif
圣經當然不如西遊記啦, 西遊記是一個人寫的, 所以首尾一貫, 無懈可擊.你明知是假的, 卻找不出破綻.
圣經是不同時代,不同作者寫的, 所以前後矛盾, 紕漏百出. 回复 13# 费事傾
不与风争
断章取义 几千年以前的事
如果我们也像你 不顾背景 更不懂啥叫经后灵光， 就成井底癞蛤蟆，蛙不了 圣經當然不如西遊記啦, 西遊記是一個人寫的, 所以首尾一貫, 無懈可擊.你明知是假的, 卻找不出破綻.
圣經是不同時代,不同作者寫的, 所以前後矛盾, 紕漏百出.
费事傾 发表于 2013-10-23 20:40 http://bbs.51.ca/images/common/back.gif
西游记虽然是一部神话故事，但唐僧西天取经，还是有历史记载的，所以，西游记多多少少还有些事。不知圣经是否有些历史考证。