本帖最后由 飞鱼IT 于 2014-8-12 13:37 编辑
http://rt.com/news/174412-malaysia-plane-russia-ukraine/
Ukrainian Su-25 fighter detected in close approach to MH17 before crash - Moscow
Published time: July 21, 2014 12:59
Edited time: July 22, 2014 15:03
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The Russian military detected a Ukrainian SU-25 fighter jet gaining height towards the MH17 Boeing on the day of the catastrophe. Kiev must explain why the military jet was tracking the passenger airplane, the Russian Defense Ministry said.
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“A Ukraine Air Force military jet was detected gaining height, it’s distance from the Malaysian Boeing was 3 to 5km,” said the head of the Main Operations Directorate of the HQ of Russia’s military forces, Lieutenant-General Andrey Kartopolov speaking at a media conference in Moscow on Monday.
“ would like to get an explanation as to why the military jet was flying along a civil aviation corridor at almost the same time and at the same level as a passenger plane,” he stated.
“The SU-25 fighter jet can gain an altitude of 10km, according to its specification,” he added. “It’s equipped with air-to-air R-60 missiles that can hit a target at a distance up to 12km, up to 5km for sure.”
The presence of the Ukrainian military jet can be confirmed by video shots made by the Rostov monitoring center, Kartopolov stated.
At the moment of the MH17 crash an American satellite was flying over the area of eastern Ukraine, according to Russia’s Defense Ministry. It urged the US to publish the space photos and data captured by it.
‘Ukrainian Buk missile system transported to militia-held area’
In addition, MH17 crashed within the operating zone of the Ukrainian army’s self-propelled, medium-range surface-to-air ‘Buk’ missile systems, the Russian general said.
“We have space images of certain places where the Ukraine’s air defense was located in the southeast of the country,” Kartapolov noted.
The first three shots that were shown by the general are dated July 14. The images show Buk missile launch systems in about 8km northwest of the city of Lugansk – a TELAR and two TELs, according to the military official.
Another image shows a radar station near Donetsk.
Radar stations of the air defense in Donetsk Region, 5km north of Donetsk city, on July 14, 2014.Photo courtesy of the Russian Defense Ministry
Radar stations of the air defense in Donetsk Region, 5km north of Donetsk city, on July 14, 2014.Photo courtesy of the Russian Defense Ministry
While the third picture shows the location of the air defense systems near Donetsk, he explained. In particular, one can clearly see a TELAR launcher and about 60 military and auxiliary vehicles, tents for vehicles and other structures, he elaborated.
Buk missile defense units in Donetsk Region, 5km north of Donetsk city, on July 14, 2014.Photo courtesy of the Russian Defense Ministry
Buk missile defense units in Donetsk Region, 5km north of Donetsk city, on July 14, 2014.Photo courtesy of the Russian Defense Ministry
“Images from this area were also made on July 17. One should notice that the missile launcher is absent . Image number five shows the Buk missile system in the morning of the same day in the area of settlement Zaroschinskoe – 50km south of Donetsk and 8km south of Shakhtyorsk," the Kartapolov said.
No Buk missile defense units in Donetsk Region, 5km north of Donetsk city, on July 17, 2014.Photo courtesy of the Russian Defense Ministry
No Buk missile defense units in Donetsk Region, 5km north of Donetsk city, on July 17, 2014.Photo courtesy of the Russian Defense Ministry
Buk missile defense units in Zaroschinskoe, 50km south of Donetsk city and 8km south of Shakhtyorsk, on July 17, 2014.Photo courtesy of the Russian Defense Ministry
Buk missile defense units in Zaroschinskoe, 50km south of Donetsk city and 8km south of Shakhtyorsk, on July 17, 2014.Photo courtesy of the Russian Defense Ministry
The question that has to be answered is why the missile system appeared near the area controlled by the local militia forces shortly before the catastrophe, he stated.
Images taken on July 18 show that the missile systems left the area of the MH17 crash, the military official said.
Kartapolov also pointed to the fact that on the day of the plane crash Ukraine’s military increased activity on the part of Ukraine’s Kupol-M1 9S18 radars, which are part of the Buk system.
"..there were 7 radars operating on July 15, 8 radars operating on July 16, and 9 radars operating on July 17 in the area. Then, starting with July 18, the intensity of radar activities radically decreased, and now there are no more than two or three radars operating a day. The reason behind this is yet to be found."
In response to Moscow’s evidence, Kiev said on Monday it had proof the missile that brought down a Malaysian airliner last week came from Russia.
"There is evidence that the missile which struck the plane was fired by terrorists, who received arms and specialists from the Russian Federation," spokesman for Ukraine's Security Council Andrey Lysenko told a news conference. "To disown this tragedy, are drawing a lot of pictures and maps. We will explore any photos and other plans produced by the Russian side."
Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko said on Monday that Kiev has “strong evidence” of the causes of the MH17 crash.
“We know exactly the place launched, we know exactly the place where it hit the civilian plane and the place where the plane crashed.”
Kiev is ready to hand the information to the international investigation commission, according to the presidential press-service.
http://rt.com/usa/179284-ron-paul-mh17-ukraine/
Ron Paul: US 'likely hiding truth' on downed Malaysian Flight MH17
Published time: August 10, 2014 13:06
Edited time: August 11, 2014 11:49
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Ron Paul (AFP Photo / Brendan Smialowski)
Ron Paul (AFP Photo / Brendan Smialowski)
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Former Congressman Ron Paul said the US knows ‘more than it is telling’ about the Malaysian aircraft that crashed in eastern Ukraine last month, killing 298 people on board and seriously damaging US-Russian relations in the process.
In an effort to inject some balance of opinion, not to mention pure sanity, into the ongoing debate over what happened to Malaysian Flight MH17, Ron Paul is convinced the US government is withholding information on the catastrophe.
"The US government has grown strangely quiet on the accusation that it was Russia or her allies that brought down the Malaysian airliner with a Buk anti-aircraft missile," Paul said on his news website on Thursday.
Ron Paul to Obama: Let’s just leave Ukraine alone!
Paul’s comments are in sharp contrast to the echo chamber of one-sided opinion inside Western mainstream media, which has almost unanimously blamed anti-Kiev militia for bringing down the commercial airline. Incredibly, in many cases Washington had nothing to show as evidence to incriminate pro-Russian rebels aside from tenuous references to social media.
“We’ve seen that there were heavy weapons moved from Russia to Ukraine, that they have moved into the hands of separatist leaders,” said White House spokesman Josh Earnest. “And according to social media reports, those weapons include the SA-11 system.”
In another instance, State Department spokeswoman Marie Harf told reporters “the Russians intend to deliver heavier and more powerful rocket launchers to the separatist forces in Ukraine, and have evidence that Russia is firing artillery from within Russia to attack Ukrainian military positions.” When veteran AP reporter Matthew Lee asked for proof, he was to be disappointed.
“I can’t get into the sources and methods behind it,” Harf responded. “I can’t tell you what the information is based on.” Lee said the allegations made by the State Department on Ukraine have fallen far short of “definitive proof.”
Just days after US intelligence officials admitted they had no conclusive evidence to prove Russia was behind the downing of the airliner, Kiev published satellite images as ‘proof’ it didn’t deploy anti-aircraft batteries around the MH17 crash site. However, these images have altered time-stamps and are from the days after the MH17 tragedy, the Russian Defense Ministry revealed, fully discrediting the Ukrainian claims.
In yet another inexplicable occurrence, Russian military detected a Ukrainian SU-25 fighter jet approaching the MH17 Boeing on the day of the catastrophe. No acceptable explanation has ever been given by Kiev as to why this fighter aircraft was so close to the doomed passenger jet moments before it was brought down.
“ would like to get an explanation as to why the military jet was flying along a civil aviation corridor at almost the same time and at the same level as a passenger plane,” Russian Lieutenant-General Andrey Kartopolov demanded days after the crash.
Paul has slammed the Obama administration, despite its arsenal of surveillance technologies at its disposal, for its failure to provide a single grain of evidence to solve the mystery of the Malaysian airliner.
"It’s hard to believe that the US, with all of its spy satellites available for monitoring everything in Ukraine, that precise proof of who did what and when is not available," the two-time presidential candidate said.
"Too bad we can’t count on our government to just tell us the truth and show us the evidence," Paul added. "I’m convinced that it knows a lot more than it’s telling us."
Although no sufficient evidence has been presented to prove that the anti-Kiev militia was responsible for the downing of the international flight, such an inconvenient oversight has not stopped the United States and Europe from slapping economic sanctions and travel bans against Russia.
Moscow hit back, saying it would place a ban on agricultural imports from the United States and the European Union. Russia’s tit-for-tat ban will certainly be felt, as food and agricultural imports from the US amounted to $1.3 billion last year, according to the US Department of Agriculture. In 2013, meanwhile, the EU’s agricultural exports to Russia totaled 11.8 billion euros ($15.8 billion).
After the crash, Ron Paul was one of a few voices calling for calm as US officials were pointing fingers without a shred of evidence to support their claims. Paul has not been afraid to say the painfully obvious things the US media, for any number of reasons, cannot find the courage to articulate.
“They will not report that the crisis in Ukraine started late last year, when EU and US-supported protesters plotted the overthrow of the elected Ukrainian president, Viktor Yanukovych,” Paul said. “Without US-sponsored ‘regime change,’ it is unlikely that hundreds would have been killed in the unrest that followed. Nor would the Malaysian Airlines crash have happened.”
Paul also found it outrageous that Western media, parroting the government line, has reported that the Malaysian flight must have been downed by “Russian-backed separatists,” because the BUK missile that reportedly brought down the aircraft was Russian made.
“They will not report that the Ukrainian government also uses the exact same Russian-made weapons,” he emphasized.
回复 27# 打一地名
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=MduT109qfP0
里面有数百条关于BUK车视频评论，各种意见，可以去看看。
本帖最后由 飞鱼IT 于 2014-8-12 14:08 编辑
美国的侦查卫星若不公布图片资料，难以获得真相。
因为参加调查的是马航和荷兰，都是弱小国家，也许最后结论会被和谐。
个人认为，不管谁击落MH17，乌克兰官方至少要负95%的责任。
1、客机在乌克兰领空被击落。主人没有保护好客人。不安全就应该封锁通道。
2、乌克兰战机为什么尾随MH17？ 导致客机偏离航线到战区上空被击落。
战区什么事情都可发生。
3、乌克兰和乌克兰民间武装都有BUK导弹车在战区。
乌克兰BUK 导弹车有卫星图片证实。 MH17被击落后消失。（
http://rt.com/news/174412-malaysia-plane-russia-ukraine/）
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里面有数百条关于BUK车视频评论，各种意见，可以去看看。
飞鱼IT 发表于 2014-8-12 13:48 http://bbs.51.ca/images/common/back.gif
YOUTUBE上的录像据说是 MH１７被击落之前的。似乎车主已经找到了。
据马拉西亚 《新海峡时报》报道：
Retired Lufthansa pilot Peter Haisenko deduced that in order to have some of those holes fraying inwardly, and the others fraying outwardly,
there had to have been a second fighter firing into the cockpit from the airliner’s starboard side.
This is critical, as no surface-fired missile (or shrapnel) hitting the airliner could possibly punch
holes into the cockpit from both sides of the plane.
“It had to have been a hail of bullets from both sides that brought the plane down. This is Haisenko’s
main discovery. You can’t have projectiles going in both directions — into the left-hand-side fuselage
panel from both its left and right sides — unless they are coming at the panel from different directions.
“Nobody before Haisenko had noticed that the projectiles had ripped through that panel from both its left side and its right side. This is what rules out any ground-fired missile,” Parry had said.
炮弹是从左右两个方向同时击穿客机。飞机残骸显示飞机遭受2种武器袭击。飞机2侧受到不同武器袭击。
这完全排除了客机是被地对空导弹击落的。
为达到不可告人的目的而不择手段。 无疑马航MH17、911和伊拉克拥核等事件及其“主流”媒体报道都是一脉相承的
本帖最后由 飞鱼IT 于 2014-8-14 13:29 编辑
为达到不可告人的目的而不择手段。 无疑马航MH17、911和伊拉克拥核等事件及其“主流”媒体报道都是一脉相承的
人生挺好 发表于 2014-8-14 12:02 http://bbs.51.ca/images/common/back.gif
不过我认为911是真的。 也许是弱国对强国一种策略，人体炸弹就是以色列在弱的时候使用的一种方法。
自从911后，美国经济一落千丈，没有那么傻的总统炸自己的世贸大厦栽赃。
另外，美国是强国，毁自己造舆论，代价太大，不合适。
911后美国就开始衰退了，本拉登打击美国的目的最后达到了。（本拉登是美国在阿富汗培养的对付前苏联的力量）
...没有那么傻的总统炸自己的世贸大厦栽赃。...
飞鱼IT 发表于 2014-8-14 13:27 http://bbs.51.ca/images/common/back.gif
这种想法就是许多人没看通911事件的关键点之一。 他们没明白美国总统只是美国少数几个美国国际大财团的木偶人罢了，那些国际大财团人物的根源、本性、战略目标和惯用手法是什么，许多人都不了解