保守党粉丝小张，你给大家说说是你在撒谎还是黄素梅在撒谎？

老态龙钟

看文章我觉得必需得看全文意思。

首先六个人都表明了他们个人的意见是倾向于修建地铁。这点很明确，勿需质疑。

最后那段话的意思我的理解是六名省议员会尊重多伦多市议会各种选择的可能性。这个说法与他们六人支持修建地铁并不矛盾，因为最终决定权不在他们六个人的手里。

我在这个帖子里只想找到这样一个答案，黄素梅是不是在撒谎？！
打一地名 发表于 2014-6-9 18:56

你看清楚，他们说的是Eglinton地铁！不是Sheppard地铁！

打一地名

你俩不要再瞎说了，黄素梅反对地铁的公开信等在yourkBBs上，署名是黄素梅办公室，难道那也是假的？
老态龙钟 发表于 2014-6-9 20:27

    :laugh:

Ransford

你俩不要再瞎说了，黄素梅反对地铁的公开信等在yourkBBs上，署名是黄素梅办公室，难道那也是假的？
老态龙钟 发表于 2014-6-9 20:27

我可不可以在51网上发个帖子, 然后署名陈良璇办公室呢, 保守党及其粉丝造假和造谣的本领在加拿大无人能比. 不信的话可以问一问加拿大谣张....:laugh:

老汤姆

证据在这里

下面是2012年3月6日议会辩论“公共交通”的现场记录（从10:40开始，省了前部分），特别注意看最后三段。http://www.ontla.on.ca/web/house-proceedings/house_detail.do?Date=2012-03-06&Parl=40&Sess=1&locale=en#P267_79713

从前面麦奸敌面对胡达克的质询，用尊重市议会决定狡辩，到最后胡达克质问省基建厅长Bob Chiarelli，你到底是支持建地铁还是反对。Bob Chiarelli只能以地铁可能超支70亿为由，并代表自由党caucus问所有自由党省议员，是否同意建地铁（再加税70亿）。结果只要是了解议会运作程序的人都应该清楚，在这种场合Bob Chiarelli是代表党魁麦奸敌在提问以堵上反对党的嘴，在座的所有自由党省议员都只能对建地铁投反对意见。这是常识。但关键不是黄素梅是否投了地铁的反对票，她肯定是投了反对票。关键在于既然你作为自由党议员只能在重大问题上与党保持一致，你后来就不应该说谎，要敢于承担。说谎就不能原谅了！

注意看最后

PUBLIC TRANSIT
Mr. Tim Hudak: Back to the Premier: We in the PC caucus believe world-class cities build subways. It’s the right thing to do. It will help bring jobs and investment to the province of Ontario.
Premier, just to make sure the record is clear, you did force Innisfil into Barrie. You forced the amalgamation base of Innisfil into Barrie without compensation. When you announced the expansion of the subway network into Vaughan, you didn’t go through this process; you made the right decision to extend it into Vaughan. We think the right decision today is for the Eglinton crosstown route underground, not tearing up streets.
I think the mayor was very clear in the most recent election that he was going to stop the gravy train and he was going to build subways. He had vast support across the city. It’s time for some leadership on this issue, Premier. Will you invest in subways and help—
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): Thank you. Premier.
Hon. Dalton McGuinty: To the Minister of Infrastructure and Transportation.
Hon. Bob Chiarelli: I think the Leader of the Opposition should know that many of the transit systems in major world-class cities have hybrid systems. They have subways, buses and light rail. Let me just review some of the world-class cities that have subways and LRT: These include Boston, Paris, Geneva, Sydney, Calgary, Edmonton, Jerusalem, London, Houston, Berlin, Dublin, Tokyo, Vienna, Brussels, Prague, Bordeaux, Amsterdam, Oslo, Barcelona, Stockholm, Edinburgh, Ottawa, Baltimore, San Francisco and Adelaide.
And you know something? Toronto is a world-class city. Toronto has a hybrid system, and this is the right decision to make.
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): Supplementary?
Mr. Tim Hudak: Hold on a second here: Now you’re saying this is the right decision to be made. This has been a change in position, I say to the Minister of Transportation and Infrastructure. Now you’re saying it’s the right thing to rip up city streets, to take away lanes permanently on Finch, on Eglinton, on Sheppard. That’s what the minister has said.
So, clearly, if you think that that’s the right decision, you’d better tell the Premier, because the Premier seems to say he has no opinion on this.
We have an opinion. We’re clear. We believe you should invest in subways. We live in Canada. You should build it underground to break gridlock, and it’s what commuters prefer. Minister, your own Metrolinx chairman, Bruce McCuaig, said on February 6, 2012, in the National Post that the subway version of the Eglinton crosstown delivered better results.
We think it’s the right thing to do. You want to tear up city streets. I ask you to reconsider: Will you support the right thing and build underground, not—
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): Thank you. Minister?
Hon. Bob Chiarelli: Mr. Speaker—
Interjections.
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): Be seated, please. Be seated, please. Thank you.
Minister?
Hon. Bob Chiarelli: Mr. Speaker, we believe in the democratic process. We respect municipalities.
I’m going to choose my words very carefully: In 22 years as an elected official, the resolution of the Leader of the Opposition is the most intellectually shallow, uninformed and politically opportunistic I have ever seen. He asks us to respect the memorandum of understanding. The memorandum of understanding was signed by the mayor. The mayor knowingly put a condition in respecting city council, by making the agreement conditional on city council approval. So the mayor is showing disrespect for his own agreement that he negotiated and signed.
We are showing respect to the city council and we are showing respect for the memorandum of understanding that we signed with the mayor.
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): Final supplementary?
Mr. Tim Hudak: You know, the minister talks about respecting democracy. Mayor Ford ran in a race of 40 candidates and he said two things: He said he would stop the gravy train and he said he’d build subways. He received 47% of the vote on that in a 40-field race. So for the minister to say that that position is intellectually shallow is an insult to the voters in the city of Toronto who endorsed this plan.
Clearly, Minister, the right thing to do for convenience for travellers, to attract investment to the city, to attract more jobs and to break gridlock is to build subways; to build underground. This is a time for provincial leadership. It flows from the province of Ontario—
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): Question?
Mr. Tim Hudak: It’s a provincial agency. Will you do the right thing to help create jobs in Toronto and our province and endorse the plan supported by—
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): Thank you. Minister?
Hon. Bob Chiarelli: Speaker, we support local government. We support local government by being fiscally responsible, by supporting—
Interjections.
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): I absolutely want to know what you guys had for breakfast.
I have asked all sides and all members to tone it down a little, and I’m asking one more time. I will tell you, to make it perfectly clear: When I name someone, it’s as a result of one and only one warning. That’s all I do, and I think you know that.
I’m asking you: I’d like to hear, as do most members, and I don’t like it when somebody’s answering and then someone on the same side is heckling or someone is asking a question and someone on the same side is shooting comments. At least let the questions get out.
1050
Interjection.
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): And I don’t need the reminder.
Carry on.
Hon. Bob Chiarelli: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, our Toronto Liberal caucus advocated for, and was able to obtain, a commitment of $8.4 billion for the transit users in the city of Toronto. That’s a tremendous commitment to local government.
Something the Leader of the Opposition likes to gloss over, having taken fiscal responsibility in his own mind, is that building entirely underground transit on Sheppard, Eglinton and Finch would cost more than $15 billion, at least $7 billion more than the $8.4 billion that we have on the table. Will the Leader of the Opposition—
Interjection.
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): The member from Nepean–Carleton, come to order.
Hon. Bob Chiarelli: —support additional taxes to pay for the subway that he is now saying he wants—

打一地名

证据在这里

下面是2012年3月6日议会辩论“公共交通”的现场记录（从10:40开始，省了前部分），特别注意看最后三段。http://www.ontla.on.ca/web/house-proceedings/house_detail.do?Date=2012-03-06&Parl=40&Sess=1&locale=en#P267_79713

从前面麦奸敌面对胡达克的质询，用尊重市议会决定狡辩，到最后胡达克质问省基建厅长Bob Chiarelli，你到底是支持建地铁还是反对。Bob Chiarelli只能以地铁可能超支70亿为由，并代表自由党caucus问所有自由党省议员，是否同意建地铁（再加税70亿）。结果只要是了解议会运作程序的人都应该清楚，在这种场合Bob Chiarelli是代表党魁麦奸敌在提问以堵上反对党的嘴，在座的所有自由党省议员都只能对建地铁投反对意见。这是常识。但关键不是黄素梅是否投了地铁的反对票，她肯定是投了反对票。关键在于既然你作为自由党议员只能在重大问题上与党保持一致，你后来就不应该说谎，要敢于承担。说谎就不能原谅了！

注意看最后

PUBLIC TRANSIT
Mr. Tim Hudak: Back to the Premier: We in the PC caucus believe world-class cities build subways. It’s the right thing to do. It will help bring jobs and investment to the province of Ontario.
Premier, just to make sure the record is clear, you did force Innisfil into Barrie. You forced the amalgamation base of Innisfil into Barrie without compensation. When you announced the expansion of the subway network into Vaughan, you didn’t go through this process; you made the right decision to extend it into Vaughan. We think the right decision today is for the Eglinton crosstown route underground, not tearing up streets.
I think the mayor was very clear in the most recent election that he was going to stop the gravy train and he was going to build subways. He had vast support across the city. It’s time for some leadership on this issue, Premier. Will you invest in subways and help—
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): Thank you. Premier.
Hon. Dalton McGuinty: To the Minister of Infrastructure and Transportation.
Hon. Bob Chiarelli: I think the Leader of the Opposition should know that many of the transit systems in major world-class cities have hybrid systems. They have subways, buses and light rail. Let me just review some of the world-class cities that have subways and LRT: These include Boston, Paris, Geneva, Sydney, Calgary, Edmonton, Jerusalem, London, Houston, Berlin, Dublin, Tokyo, Vienna, Brussels, Prague, Bordeaux, Amsterdam, Oslo, Barcelona, Stockholm, Edinburgh, Ottawa, Baltimore, San Francisco and Adelaide.
And you know something? Toronto is a world-class city. Toronto has a hybrid system, and this is the right decision to make.
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): Supplementary?
Mr. Tim Hudak: Hold on a second here: Now you’re saying this is the right decision to be made. This has been a change in position, I say to the Minister of Transportation and Infrastructure. Now you’re saying it’s the right thing to rip up city streets, to take away lanes permanently on Finch, on Eglinton, on Sheppard. That’s what the minister has said.
So, clearly, if you think that that’s the right decision, you’d better tell the Premier, because the Premier seems to say he has no opinion on this.
We have an opinion. We’re clear. We believe you should invest in subways. We live in Canada. You should build it underground to break gridlock, and it’s what commuters prefer. Minister, your own Metrolinx chairman, Bruce McCuaig, said on February 6, 2012, in the National Post that the subway version of the Eglinton crosstown delivered better results.
We think it’s the right thing to do. You want to tear up city streets. I ask you to reconsider: Will you support the right thing and build underground, not—
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): Thank you. Minister?
Hon. Bob Chiarelli: Mr. Speaker—
Interjections.
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): Be seated, please. Be seated, please. Thank you.
Minister?
Hon. Bob Chiarelli: Mr. Speaker, we believe in the democratic process. We respect municipalities.
I’m going to choose my words very carefully: In 22 years as an elected official, the resolution of the Leader of the Opposition is the most intellectually shallow, uninformed and politically opportunistic I have ever seen. He asks us to respect the memorandum of understanding. The memorandum of understanding was signed by the mayor. The mayor knowingly put a condition in respecting city council, by making the agreement conditional on city council approval. So the mayor is showing disrespect for his own agreement that he negotiated and signed.
We are showing respect to the city council and we are showing respect for the memorandum of understanding that we signed with the mayor.
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): Final supplementary?
Mr. Tim Hudak: You know, the minister talks about respecting democracy. Mayor Ford ran in a race of 40 candidates and he said two things: He said he would stop the gravy train and he said he’d build subways. He received 47% of the vote on that in a 40-field race. So for the minister to say that that position is intellectually shallow is an insult to the voters in the city of Toronto who endorsed this plan.
Clearly, Minister, the right thing to do for convenience for travellers, to attract investment to the city, to attract more jobs and to break gridlock is to build subways; to build underground. This is a time for provincial leadership. It flows from the province of Ontario—
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): Question?
Mr. Tim Hudak: It’s a provincial agency. Will you do the right thing to help create jobs in Toronto and our province and endorse the plan supported by—
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): Thank you. Minister?
Hon. Bob Chiarelli: Speaker, we support local government. We support local government by being fiscally responsible, by supporting—
Interjections.
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): I absolutely want to know what you guys had for breakfast.
I have asked all sides and all members to tone it down a little, and I’m asking one more time. I will tell you, to make it perfectly clear: When I name someone, it’s as a result of one and only one warning. That’s all I do, and I think you know that.
I’m asking you: I’d like to hear, as do most members, and I don’t like it when somebody’s answering and then someone on the same side is heckling or someone is asking a question and someone on the same side is shooting comments. At least let the questions get out.
1050
Interjection.
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): And I don’t need the reminder.
Carry on.
Hon. Bob Chiarelli: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, our Toronto Liberal caucus advocated for, and was able to obtain, a commitment of $8.4 billion for the transit users in the city of Toronto. That’s a tremendous commitment to local government.
Something the Leader of the Opposition likes to gloss over, having taken fiscal responsibility in his own mind, is that building entirely underground transit on Sheppard, Eglinton and Finch would cost more than $15 billion, at least $7 billion more than the $8.4 billion that we have on the table. Will the Leader of the Opposition—
Interjection.
The Speaker (Hon. Dave Levac): The member from Nepean–Carleton, come to order.
Hon. Bob Chiarelli: —support additional taxes to pay for the subway that he is now saying he wants—
老汤姆 发表于 2014-6-9 21:06

谢谢你给出了这段辩论记录。

从整段记录中我没有看到任何投票表决的动议和最终结果。全段都是针对省府是否支持多伦多市府建地铁展开的辩论。

她连一句话都没有说，更不要说投票反对了。

但可以肯定的是在此会议结束后的第１５天，她和其他５名 MPPs 联名写信给多伦多市府表示支持胖子修建地铁的动议。

多伦多老油条

辩论最后就是投票：

Ayes

    Arnott, Ted
    Bailey, Robert
    Barrett, Toby
    Chudleigh, Ted
    Clark, Steve
    Dunlop, Garfield
    Elliott, Christine
    Fedeli, Victor
    Hardeman, Ernie
    Harris, Michael
    Hudak, Tim
    Jackson, Rod

    Jones, Sylvia
    Klees, Frank
    Leone, Rob
    MacLaren, Jack
    MacLeod, Lisa
    McDonell, Jim
    McKenna, Jane
    McNaughton, Monte
    Miller, Norm
    Milligan, Rob E.
    Nicholls, Rick
    O’Toole, John

    Ouellette, Jerry J.
    Pettapiece, Randy
    Scott, Laurie
    Shurman, Peter
    Smith, Todd
    Thompson, Lisa M.
    Walker, Bill
    Wilson, Jim
    Witmer, Elizabeth
    Yakabuski, John
    Yurek, Jeff

The Acting Speaker (Mrs. Julia Munro): All those opposed will please rise one at a time and be recorded by the Clerk.
Nays

    Albanese, Laura
    Armstrong, Teresa J.
    Balkissoon, Bas
    Bartolucci, Rick
    Bentley, Christopher
    Berardinetti, Lorenzo
    Best, Margarett
    Bisson, Gilles
    Bradley, James J.
    Broten, Laurel C.
    Cansfield, Donna H.
    Chan, Michael
    Chiarelli, Bob
    Colle, Mike
    Coteau, Michael
    Crack, Grant
    Craitor, Kim
    Damerla, Dipika
    Delaney, Bob
    Dhillon, Vic
    Dickson, Joe
    DiNovo, Cheri

    Duguid, Brad
    Duncan, Dwight
    Flynn, Kevin Daniel
    Forster, Cindy
    Gerretsen, John
    Gravelle, Michael
    Horwath, Andrea
    Hoskins, Eric
    Jaczek, Helena
    Jeffrey, Linda
    Kwinter, Monte
    Leal, Jeff
    MacCharles, Tracy
    Mangat, Amrit
    Marchese, Rosario
    Matthews, Deborah
    McGuinty, Dalton
    McMeekin, Ted
    McNeely, Phil
    Meilleur, Madeleine
    Miller, Paul
    Milloy, John

    Moridi, Reza
    Murray, Glen R.
    Naqvi, Yasir
    Natyshak, Taras
    Orazietti, David
    Piruzza, Teresa
    Prue, Michael
    Qaadri, Shafiq
    Sandals, Liz
    Schein, Jonah
    Sergio, Mario
    Singh, Jagmeet
    Sorbara, Greg
    Sousa, Charles
    Tabuns, Peter
    Takhar, Harinder S.
    Taylor, Monique
    Vanthof, John
    Wong, Soo
    Wynne, Kathleen O.
    Zimmer, David

黄议员是投的反对票，她的名字就在女省长的上方。

多伦多老油条

感觉这个选区黄议员非常危险啊。

加拿大老张

感觉这个选区黄议员非常危险啊。
新来乍到 发表于 2014-6-9 22:38

谢谢你把投票结果全公开了! 自由党粉丝还想替黄议员狡辩, 投票反对sheppard地铁延长线的黄议员, 被美化成支持世家堡建地铁的省议员. 以为大家都是新移民, 不知道sheppard地铁延长线在世家堡?
安省自由党没办法如法炮制, 象电厂赔偿丑闻那样, 雇佣临时工删除省议会投票记录, 留下了铁证.:laugh:

夏候草

事实证明自由党及其打手一贯撒谎

辩论最后就是投票：

Ayes

    Arnott, Ted
    Bailey, Robert
    Barrett, Toby
    Chudleigh, Ted
    Clark, Steve
    Dunlop, Garfield
    Elliott, Christine
    Fedeli, Victor
    Hardeman, Ernie
    Harris, Michael
    Hudak, Tim
    Jackson, Rod

    Jones, Sylvia
    Klees, Frank
    Leone, Rob
    MacLaren, Jack
    MacLeod, Lisa
    McDonell, Jim
    McKenna, Jane
    McNaughton, Monte
    Miller, Norm
    Milligan, Rob E.
    Nicholls, Rick
    O’Toole, John

    Ouellette, Jerry J.
    Pettapiece, Randy
    Scott, Laurie
    Shurman, Peter
    Smith, Todd
    Thompson, Lisa M.
    Walker, Bill
    Wilson, Jim
    Witmer, Elizabeth
    Yakabuski, John
    Yurek, Jeff

The Acting Speaker (Mrs. Julia Munro): All those opposed will please rise one at a time and be recorded by the Clerk.
Nays

    Albanese, Laura
    Armstrong, Teresa J.
    Balkissoon, Bas
    Bartolucci, Rick
    Bentley, Christopher
    Berardinetti, Lorenzo
    Best, Margarett
    Bisson, Gilles
    Bradley, James J.
    Broten, Laurel C.
    Cansfield, Donna H.
    Chan, Michael
    Chiarelli, Bob
    Colle, Mike
    Coteau, Michael
    Crack, Grant
    Craitor, Kim
    Damerla, Dipika
    Delaney, Bob
    Dhillon, Vic
    Dickson, Joe
    DiNovo, Cheri

    Duguid, Brad
    Duncan, Dwight
    Flynn, Kevin Daniel
    Forster, Cindy
    Gerretsen, John
    Gravelle, Michael
    Horwath, Andrea
    Hoskins, Eric
    Jaczek, Helena
    Jeffrey, Linda
    Kwinter, Monte
    Leal, Jeff
    MacCharles, Tracy
    Mangat, Amrit
    Marchese, Rosario
    Matthews, Deborah
    McGuinty, Dalton
    McMeekin, Ted
    McNeely, Phil
    Meilleur, Madeleine
    Miller, Paul
    Milloy, John

    Moridi, Reza
    Murray, Glen R.
    Naqvi, Yasir
    Natyshak, Taras
    Orazietti, David
    Piruzza, Teresa
    Prue, Michael
    Qaadri, Shafiq
    Sandals, Liz
    Schein, Jonah
    Sergio, Mario
    Singh, Jagmeet
    Sorbara, Greg
    Sousa, Charles
    Tabuns, Peter
    Takhar, Harinder S.
    Taylor, Monique
    Vanthof, John
    Wong, Soo
    Wynne, Kathleen O.
    Zimmer, David

黄议员是投的反对票，她的名字就在女省长的上方。
新来乍到 发表于 2014-6-9 22:31